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[sdpd] My last comment...
Dear Armel,
in contrast to other people, I do not have that much time to argue
about the meaning of life (science, workshops or whatever).
Teaching, research and my family fills my day quite satisfactory.
Therefore, I keep my response short. Why do you think
there are 9 participants at the internet course but 100
at the workshop ?
I am waiting for your >20 reasons which will soon
show up.
All the best,
Robert.
Armel Le Bail schrieb:
> >Some comments...,
> >
> >in my opinion, there is a big difference between
> >an internet course and a workshop.
>
> Internet courses are only 5 years old, in general, and much less
> for the few powder diffraction courses (1 year). There is some lack
> of experience for comparing workshops and Internet courses.
>
> I would say that an Internet course is much more difficult to
> follow than a workshop, and that more will stay in the student
> memory. The fact is, in a course, that the student will obtain the next
> material after having sent his solutions for the previous session
> exercises. It is not possible to wait for students results during a
> workshop. The schedule must be respected. No evaluation
> will be provided - and no diploma. Moreover, a complete real
> SDPD is generally longer than the whole workshop duration.
> Asynchronous course let the student going at his own speed.
>
> I remember Karimat El-Sayed worrying about the Powder
> Diffraction Workshop at IUCr Glasgow : no document at all
> was available, nothing was distributed - she considered that
> this was not a workshop. Robert said that the documents will
> be available on the Internet in a few months. The fact is that
> very few speakers sent their contributions, in spite of Robert's
> efforts...
>
> It would be hard to propose an Internet course without any document.
> This is a first big difference. Then, an Internet course will be
> 3 months to 1 year long, not 1/2 to 5 days.
>
> >First of all, workshops are a good source for personal
> >contacts and it is always of great help to have the tutors
> >around (and not sitting some 1000 miles away).
>
> 100 participants for 20 speakers, the time for personal
> contact will not be that large. Will you ensure for each
> participant that they will obtain help from the tutors after
> the workshop, by email ? In the Internet course case, there
> is no limit in email exchanges during several months. The email
> reaches the tutor in a few seconds. The 1000 miles are not
> an obstacle.
>
> >In addition, participants are welcome to bring their own data sets
> >and I am sure that most tutors will see it as a challenge to assist in
> >the structure solution.
>
> Most participants will be there for learning to solve alone their
> own problem. Generally, asking for help is when you do not want
> to learn the method, or when you failed after many efforts.
> Imagine each participant having 2 real problems : 200 structures
> to determine. I wish you this will not be the case... the tutors
> will come back home with 2-3 years of work, at least, if they share
> the job. In my memory about workshops, this never happens,
> fortunately.
>
> >to Armel: You are cordially invited to give a lecture (+exercise ?)
> >on ESPOIR if you like. Just let me know.
>
> Thanks for this late invitation.
> The advantage of free open codes is that they are immediately
> fully available, with manual and exercises with solution. No need
> to wait for October. Lachlan asked me for the latest ESPOIR
> version to be included in the package of freely available programs
> he will speak about. That is just fine for me. I have already shown ESPOIR
> at Glasgow and EPDIC-7, Barcelona. The conferences and posters
> or preprints are all available on the Internet. Exercises without correction
> are included in the SDPD Internet course. I am ready to send you
> some data at the beginning of your workshop, and see if the
> tutors can solve those real problems before the workshop end.
> Remember the SDPD Round Robin, with 2 solutions only after one
> month and 70 participants, and indexing was provided. A workshop
> is too short for doing completely a difficult SDPD. And quite short
> for really learning from A to Z to do it. A big difference.
>
> Armel
> http://www.cristal.org/sdpd/espoir/
>